Hi everybodyI’m building a OO gauge model of Fenny Compton and Clifford Sidings over here in Belgium.Quite a strange idea but so be it…In view of this I plan to transform a RTR Beatie Well Tank into SMJR N° 5 the 2-4-0T and use some etchings for the…Continue
Started by Jack Freuville Aug 29.
Layouts based on actual SMJR locations are few and far between. Due to being given notice on clubroom, Olney as featured in BRM Sept 2023 is for sale!This is a rare opportunity to acquire a beautiful, 15 years in the making, ready to run model…Continue
Started by Nicholas Young Jul 26.
Hi all members.I was wondering if you could help by subscribing to my YouTube channel ‘NWP EXPLORING’ Mainly railway history and some exploring the SMJ .im planning to explore and video more of the SMJ , and if you have a desired area you would…Continue
Started by Neil. Last reply by Henry Jul 10.
An improbable, funny, but absolutely true story relating to the Kineton military railway.Long after my Army days I still retained an affection and passing interest in Kineton ammunition depot where I served during the 1960s. Coupled to a 'love' of…Continue
Started by Dave Hayward. Last reply by Henry Jul 10.
I have an "O" gauge gateneal 2-4-0 Tank Beyer Peacock loco kit, recently acquired from a model show, built to a high standard, but unfinished !
I wish to know the livery(ies) of the loco's from 1903 (1916) to 1923 in order to finish this model,
I am aware that some of these loco's were sold to the war dep't in 1916 but one passed in LMS ownership becoming LMS 290.
The livery pre 1903 was Crimson Red.
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Ian
During the 1960's I had a number of chats with former SMJ workers and my notes confirm that the locos were painted black. One then very elderly ex driver used the term "North Western Black". I have had sight of some correspondence between the company and Beyer Peacock concerning loco 18 that mentions "standard goods livery" surely this can only mean black! You will be aware that for a very small company the SMJ sacrificed a significant percentage of its workforce during the Great War. I was told that loco cleaning had to be suspended on many occasions due to lack of manpower. Those men that were available were needed to keep the few working locos running. It does not appear to be known when, if ever, the livery on the 2-4-0's was changed. I suspect that they were never repainted but would love to hear if anyone knows otherwise.
John
It partly depends on the specific fittings you have.
If the model is in "as built" condition, with safety valves connected to a bell topped dome, then the likelihood is that it will be in crimson lake, lined with yellow/black/yellow with reversed corners, with an E&W plate on the side tanks and a number plate on the bunker, like this (albeit my corners are not reversed - incorrect information when the builder lined it!):
If the dome is a simpler, rounded, shape with safety valves over the firebox, then the loco is most likely to be in SMJ livery, i.e. glossy black with yellow/green/yellow lining. This is the condition the locos were in after reboilering, but it would also apply for a few months to them in EWJR condition.
In between about 1903 and 1907, number 5 at least seems to have had a new cab spectacle plate fitted with smaller windows. What the livery would be then I have no idea as the only photos I have are in black and white(!).
Neither of the 2-4-0 tanks passed into LMS ownership, both going to the War Department: 290 was the 2-4-0 tender loco, but this was quickly scrapped.
Hope that helps - as well as Dunn's book, Simpson and Riley is of some help, although I think some of the "facts" in the latter are suspect as they do not tie up with other sources, including Beyer, Peacock drawings.
Simon
Hi Ian,
The Gateneal kit is for the loco in later condition, from what I have seen of it and what you say. It may have run in EWJR guise, but if so not for long. The obvious colour would therefore be a glossy black, with the yellow/green/yellow lining and lettered SMJ. Nigel Digby did a painting of this to illustrate his article on SMJR liveries in British Railway Modelling, back in June or July 1998, I think.
My model was built about 20 years ago by the late Norman Pattenden, to drawings in Model Railway News by Tom Lindsay. He built it for his projected MSWJR layout, and when he went off that, offered the loco to me for a very reasonable sum. I had to remove the MSWJ lettering, which made the paint underneath a bit thin, hence the weathering on the loco. I also fitted up the Westinghouse pump. This is all ironic as of the MSWJR (or its forerunners) ordered 3 locos and could only pay for one, the other two going to the EWJR.
Talk about (modelling) art imitating life...
Simon
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